Q+A: Panel response to Tariana Turia interview 

Source: NZPATariana Turia

• WATCH the video (7:44)

The Q+A panel's response to Guyon Espiner's interview with Maori Party co-leader Tariana Turia.

PAUL So we've heard from the Maori Party Co-Leader Tariana Turia, what did you panel think? Fault on both sides she said with this business this week of the Maori TV Rugby World Cup bit.

DEREK FOX - Former Maori Television Chair
I think she's being diplomatic. I think that by and large the greatest fault is on the government's side. The government was told, the Ministry of Finance no less, who is the shareholding minister for MTS was told on June 23rd about the bid. For them to be saying late in September we didn't know is completely incorrect.

PAUL Yeah but the issue here is that three million dollars from Te Puni Kokere, when did the government know about that?

DEREK It knew in advance of the bid going in, the bid went in on the 4th or 5th of September, it was told before that, there are letters Paul, there's a paper trail, there's an exchange of information on this, there's a whole list of meetings on this, that show that elements of the government were told, the fact that they chose not to listen, didn't believe in it...

PAUL Well that's it isn't it, they didn't believe that the Maori Party could actually put together a bid which would probably win.

DEREK So Hori's are no good then eh, is that the basic line that you can't do anything and therefore oh we can't possibly have you showing ...

PAUL What the government really seems genuinely concerned about is that if TVNZ and TV3 did not get the rights they wouldn't bother to do much promotion which wouldn't help bums on seats at the World Cup, Stephen what do you think, was it racist?

STEPHEN FRANKS - Former Act MP
I would imagine it was much more about the purpose of funding, I don't think anyone passing the vote for Te Puni Kokere thought that it was going to go into rugby rights, and it is relevant. I mean the question is - or the argument I guess is - does this advance the cause of Te Reo. Te Puni Kokere has got other responsibilities....

DEREK There's a whole range of things there's a whole business case around this.

STEPHEN Hang on a minute, there may be a business case around it but the question is the money that was given for the improvement of the statistics for Maori and of Maori lives, does rugby do it, and that's the question that's hardly been debated. I mean it may be that it does, but I haven't seen any research that says people won't feel irritated.

PAUL Let's talk about what it all meant this week for the sinews if you like of the coalition, here's how Mrs Turia responds to a question about is there tension in the government.

Tariana Turia: 'There's always tension between a cultural political party and a mainstream political party, there's a natural tension between us because of the votes, there's no doubt about that.'

PAUL And that's what intrigued you about the week really was the political management which you keep talking about of course.

THERESE ARSENEAU - Political Analyst
Yes, and there's no doubt, it's always difficult for a smaller party who becomes involved in government, but I think it's particularly difficult for the Maori Party, and I say that for a couple of reasons, first of all they are essentially a grass roots movement, and a movement based around consensus building, so you try to pop that into the sort of discipline of a government system and it can be quite difficult, but let's face it the other issue is they're working with National, and potentially that is not what their voters wanted, I mean a lot of polling during the election indicated it would not have been their first choice, but what's made it work so far is very good personal relationships, because that is the glue that holds this whole thing together, and the scary thing in this case was that seemed to break down.

PAUL Well yes, I mean for some days the government looked like a headless chook.

THERESE For some days? For most of the week actually.

PAUL Yes, until John Key of course tidied it up at the end of the week which he had to do.

THERESE But the fact that we saw that at all showed that there's a real dysfunction in this government, we should not have seen that played out in public.

PAUL Has this week damaged the sinews of this coalition, of this partnership between the Maori Party and National?

DEREK There's always little tensions going on, yes it has damaged it, it has damaged it, and I mean the rubber's hit the road now you know there was damage with the Super City seats, there's debate around the ETS, there will be debate around ACC and so there's all of those things which have now sort of sharpened the point a bit I think.

PAUL Another thing Mrs Turia was talking about, in fact she started to lean forward in her seat, becomes quite animated and positive about and authoritative about is Whanauora which she's determined and she's looking at possibly a billion dollars of access there, because she says a billion dollars is probably being wasted, what do you make of that?

STEPHEN Well she said a billion's being wasted, I mean I think it could be the most significant thing for the country in the long term to have the Maori Party leading the charge on reform of welfare would be fantastic. A right wing party can't do it because it turns to class war, it should have been Labour in the ten best years we've had in this country they just threw more and more money into the pit that's created this morass, and she is saying quite interesting stuff you know, families are gonna have to learn not to be dependent on the state, we want a billion dollars. My puzzle though was how you spend a billion dollars to make people less dependent.

PAUL Do you know exactly what Whanauora is?

STEPHEN Oh I'd love to know, I mean Guyon was asking her but perhaps she decided that it was not enough time to explain.

DEREK I've got a clue. Whanauora is an holistic approach to dealing with these woes, rather than saying this is a health problem here and this is a something here and this is a something here, and a something here, and this all benefits - Whanauora means a well family, what do you need for a well family Paul? You need a decent wage for starters, you need a decent place to live with a dry house, so the kids aren't getting crook all the time, and so they're well fed, they get to go to school, they learn well, and they contribute positively to this community, that's Whanauora. At the moment each of those little things - the other thing is because they're better educated they're getting better jobs, they may not get so much involved in petty crime, which in turn leads to other things. At the moment we just go here, we deal with these little silos, somebody pinched the money for this, right that's a justice matter, it's a this matter, it's a that matter, it's a that matter. Whanauora combines those things and works at getting those families well.

THERESE And I think what's pretty clear from the interview is that now is one of the major focuses for the Maori Party, and at the end of three years when they're ticking off the successes this is going to be something that they really want to gain on, the other is the Foreshore and Seabed I think.

PAUL And that's pretty obvious that we're heading for repeal isn't it, from what she was saying?

THERESE She wasn't being pushed on it but yeah.

PAUL They're keeping close, have you got repeal?

DEREK I think repeal will occur, what happens next is another issue, and it's another one of the problems - excuse me - having to try and teach fellas like Stephen, we've gotta try and educate them on things and so it's a matter just like Whanauora we've gotta teach em.

STEPHEN I'm looking forward to that one.

DEREK Well it could take a while you can see the difficulties we're up against when you look at Stephen. The thing is with Foreshore and Seabed, repeal the Act, it was clearly unfair, even Stephen's party said it was unfair.