Response to LORD PATTEN interview
PAUL Copenhagen he says is going to be as important as Versailleslles, do you agree with that?
MIKE Yes, look that was a very good interview Paul, you didn't interrupt him, and he was able to make a case, that should be the issues we're talking about rather than arguing, to present the future. Now I sit on a board with this bloke he is a very substantial person. I think the point he makes about the domino theory in Afghanistan is spot on. It's always been about Pakistan.
PAUL Can I just go to what he actually said on that because this was a big call on his part.
Lord Patten: 'In Vietnam talked about dominoes and I think it was a bogus metaphor, in Afghanistan I really believe the dominoes argument, I think that if we were to walk away from Afghanistan we'd find the props kicked from under democratic politicians in Pakistan.'
PAUL And then what Mike?
MIKE Well it's always been about Pakistan, these are false boundaries drawn up by some Liverpool surveyor, and the tribes and families move back and forth, and this is as serious as it gets, this brings into focus the India Pakistan issue, it is a bit destabilising issue, it is not a small thing. It is an adult thing, and it is very dangerous, and China and India and the grown ups and the adults are going to have to focus on this, are focusing on it to be fair.
PAUL We read the other day the Pentagon are getting very impatient with Obama's reluctance to commit what those 40,000 more troops. Is he right to hold out a strategy and exit strategy?
MIKE Absolutely, and to think it through, winning a war for a short time can be quite easy then what happens, and if you study the history of Afghanistan they beat the Soviets, they beat the British Empire, this is not a state, it's a state of mind and the Taliban are pretty as evil as you get in terms of our values, there is no military solution, there never really is, there's only a political solution, but the absence of a military response pushes away your chance to negotiate a political settlement.
PAUL Matt McCarten climate change, he's passionate about climate change, he said every one of us has gotta change the way we behave.
MATT Yeah well it will be nice to see when to talks to Key and Hide about that because they seem to have a different view, but I wouldn't put it up there, I think that countries - they are driven by politics and that they will do deals which suit them, it may be as important as Versailleslles and I hope the outcome is not as mad, but it's sort of another step, I think politicians will always go for the lowest common denominator and it will continue, I think we've got politicians in our cabinet who still deny there's even a problem.
PAUL Yes he's quite ruthless in the book with the deniers Therese?
THERESE But he's also got some problems on his own patch, I mean in Europe we're seeing a divide on climate change between the East and the West, you know those four Warsaw Pact countries he talked about who are still developing, and they've gone to court in Europe and have actually won their first case, Poland and Estonia I think it was, and six more countries are challenging it, and the court has said that the EU had overstepped its bounds in terms of setting limits for those countries, so there's a fight there in Europe as well.
MIKE This is not easy but it's doable, it won't be like this though, cos they lasted six months, it's the first international conference on in French. The first time that the President had left his country for the conference, but if you look back 50 years the Thames was polluted, the Great Lakes were catching on fire in America, you couldn't get water out of the Rhine, and this can be a doable thing moved over a period of time. Do not expect at Copenhagen to suddenly get a breakthrough, it will be a process.
MATT Cos countries like China and India have got a good case, they say it's alright for you lot who are developed and made the mess and now you want to stop our economic growth.
MIKE This is the paradox of the whole thing, it is a paradox, unless you keep oil prices around a hundred dollars a barrel you will not be driving up the alternative - that's the deal.
PAUL Week ahead, what's the big story you'll be looking forward to this week?
MATT I think that the unravelling of John Ryles' announcement is going to be big, they've found a complete flip flop, it's a rejection of the old right, they're going back from federation to centralisation in health.
Share your thoughts on our messageboard below
Provocative, unflinching, Thursday 9:30pm
Back Benches - giving politics back to the people
The way New Zealand wakes up weekdays, 6:30am
No one gets you closer, weeknights 7pm
Looking out for the little guy, Wednesday 7:30pm
Meet the people that bring you the news
TV ONE weekdays, 6am
The home of NZ politics - Sunday, 9am TV ONE
Where there's a story, we'll find it, Sunday 7:30pm
Te Karere, Maori News - 4pm weekdays, TV ONE
News on digital channel TVNZ 7
Advertising
post new comment
add to this thread
