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Hillary Clinton being interviewed by Guyon Espiner - Source: ONE News -
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Paul Holmes speaks with Guyon Espiner about his interview with US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.
PAUL A very big week for New Zealand and the United States, and after three very short days in New Zealand, Hillary Clinton headed off yesterday in a 757, leaving behind what's been called a 'new era in New Zealand/US relations'. Here's what Madame Secretary said in that conversation with our own Guyon Espiner on Friday afternoon about this relationship.
HILLARY CLINTON - US Secretary of State
We work together on everything from climate change and renewable
energy to non-proliferation, our soldiers are working together in
Afghanistan, and just on so many fronts. But I do think there
was the perhaps lingering impression that, uh, for whatever reason
the last 25 years had served as an obstacle to our close
partnership, and I'm glad that the ice has crushed, or melted, or
whatever the metaphor might be.
PAUL So joining us now live from Wellington is Guyon Espiner. That was Guyon's interview, of course, with the Secretary of State. So, total defrost, total melt? What do you think, Guyon?
GUYON ESPINER - Political Editor
Well, I think so, but it's important to recognise that the United
States has much closer relationships in the Asia-Pacific.
They have alliance relationships with Japan, with the Philippines,
with Thailand, with Australia. So they are alliance partners
with them - they're allies. We are, in the new parlance,
partners. Not quite as close.
PAUL No. So if we get beaten up, for example, by some foreign aggressor, there's no guarantee we get protection?
GUYON That's right. An alliance is basically where you agree to fight each other's wars. I mean, those countries I talked about are ones with military bases on them, they are strategic allies for the United States. So it is important to remember that we haven't got that status, but we've got the next best thing, basically, and this is what that did, it takes you to as good as you're gonna get without that alliance status.
PAUL How did you find her? She seemed to connect very well with so many different kinds of people. She seemed extraordinarily charming and friendly. How did you find her?
GUYON Absolutely. And a rare combination of the style and the substance. It's not often that you see such a slick politician who also has a very good grasp of the detail. I mean, she knew that New Zealand had peacekeepers in the Solomon Islands, for example, and other details that you wouldn't really expect someone with such an enormous global brief to actually have. So not only was she engaging and, as you say, charming, but she was pretty substantial in terms of her handle on the detail.
PAUL And we've got to say, too, I mean, that was quite extraordinary access for New Zealand news media, too, an American Secretary of State. I never was able to get an interview with an Australian prime minister, they said, 'There's no votes in it, mate, there's only risk, only downside.' And there's Secretary of State Hillary Clinton doing an interview with a relatively small media outlet in New Zealand.
GUYON I think you're absolutely right. I can't remember the last time we got a one-on-one interview with a politician of that standing. And it shows that she is taking some care with this relationship, to do that. And to do the Town Hall meeting that she did in Christchurch, and take questions and engage with the public, I mean, often these people hole up in their hotel rooms, do a quick photo opportunity and they're out, but she did a lot. And remember this is on a multi-country tour where every minute is accounted for, so it was quite an extraordinary level of engagement that she showed with New Zealand.
PAUL A great deal of openness in the Christchurch Town Hall meeting, cos Jon Johansson went to that. We'll talk to him about that shortly. There was much made this week, and it was very gratifying to see, of the military ties between our two countries. Let's see what the Secretary of State said about that.
HILLARY CLINTON
A lot of the World War II veterans were telling me that they'd
flown with American squadrons, they had trained with American
service members. So I think that there is a closeness, but we
need to update it. We need to make sure that we're looking
toward the future, not the past.
PAUL So what does that mean exactly, what do you take from that, Guyon? Where are we militarily?
GUYON We are closer and getting closer. There will be more top-level military and political visits from high-ranking people in the military. There will be more training, she did spell that out. A couple of big tests to watch for - will we increase troops in Afghanistan, and will they stay longer? That'll be the first big test. Because they've showered all this affection on us, it's gonna be interesting later in the year when the Cabinet sits around the table to determine whether the SAS stay on for a bit longer. This'll put a bit of pressure on in terms of that, I think.
PAUL Did she have any comment about the midterm elections? Did you get a moment to discuss that with her?
GUYON We did, actually, and she trotted out the line that you always get hammered in the midterm election, that it happened to her husband, Bill Clinton, in '94, I think the date was. But interestingly, she ruled herself out of the presidency. There was a bit of interest overseas about that comment, because there was some thought that because Obama had been hammered at the midterms that did this open the door for Clinton to actually come in and fulfil John Key's prophesy that she would be President Clinton one day? But she said, 'No, no, no. Not me.'
PAUL Yes, there was some interest as to why she was at this particular time on a 17-nation Asian tour, well away from the midterm elections. And, of course, your interview is going to be played on Fox News in the United States. And congratulations, you are excessively modest, Guyon, on your world exclusive declaration from Hillary Clinton that she won't be running for the White House.